tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5022318990784415929.post6235056777350192623..comments2023-10-20T11:17:47.246-04:00Comments on Two Nerdy History Girls: Who Was That Masked Lady?Unknownnoreply@blogger.comBlogger21125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5022318990784415929.post-65850308940570637002010-02-23T18:41:06.581-05:002010-02-23T18:41:06.581-05:00I think that some were paper mache, others were ma...I think that some were paper mache, others were made of leather.<br />Le Loup.Keithhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12562001301604097606noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5022318990784415929.post-79837648351908539642010-02-23T14:29:17.088-05:002010-02-23T14:29:17.088-05:00Great post! Keep the fashion stuff coming...
Here...Great post! Keep the fashion stuff coming...<br /><br />Here is a picture of a full mask:<br />http://blog.raucousroyals.com/2010/02/masked-lady.html<br /><br />Very creepy looking! You have to think that these would not be too comfortable. At least with the half mask, you could breath. I am not sure what material 16th century masks were made of? Anyone know? It had to be something breathable?Bearded Ladyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06182921236123895352noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5022318990784415929.post-22894041739771884882010-02-22T21:17:18.641-05:002010-02-22T21:17:18.641-05:00But have you visited here:
http://woodsrunnersdiar...But have you visited here:<br />http://woodsrunnersdiary.blogspot.com/search?q=masks<br />and here:<br />http://woodsrunnersdiary.blogspot.com/search?q=masquerade<br />and seen this hansome fellow!<br />Yours Truely of course,<br />Le Loup.Keithhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12562001301604097606noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5022318990784415929.post-84516277065995983652010-02-22T20:22:44.374-05:002010-02-22T20:22:44.374-05:00It doesn't seem quite fair that only women had...It doesn't seem quite fair that only women had to preserve their reputations with anonymity and mystery, does it?<br /><br />Another example of half-covered faces: Women in 19th century Lima, Peru wore a cloth draped diagonally across their faces, leaving one eye and (I guess) a bit of a cheekbone open. It's not a mask, but not exactly a veil either.<br /><br />See the second section here for an example: http://www.womeninworldhistory.com/lesson19.html<br /><br />Thanks for a great post! That was very interesting to learn about.Carrie Callaghanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14054716159593704969noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5022318990784415929.post-67820870727122419822010-02-22T19:03:49.703-05:002010-02-22T19:03:49.703-05:00This comment has been removed by the author.Isabella Bradford/Susan Holloway Scotthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00997375216314200469noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5022318990784415929.post-64205764991611246482010-02-22T19:03:46.474-05:002010-02-22T19:03:46.474-05:00Ah, many visiting friends today! :)
M. le Loup --...Ah, many visiting friends today! :)<br /><br />M. le Loup -- I don't believe I've ever seen a reference to a 17th c. man in a mask. These seem to have been a lady's accessory. Which is not to say that no man ever wore one -- just that I can't quote a reference one way or another.<br /><br />Miss Moppet--Thank you so much for these two quotes! Amber is, well, AMBER: what else can be said? The other quote was new to me, and the detail about the waxed interior was quite extraordinary. Studying historic dress is this kind of treasure hunt, finding small comments and clues in unexpected places. Thank you for sharing your research!<br /><br />Sandra -- I'm glad to see you here, and glad, too, to have someone else trying to remember a 17th c. masked man, English or French.<br /><br />Unless, of course, we include the ever-mysterious Man in the Iron Mask....Isabella Bradford/Susan Holloway Scotthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00997375216314200469noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5022318990784415929.post-4014682339163969692010-02-22T18:11:24.775-05:002010-02-22T18:11:24.775-05:00Susan, hello! Wonderful post. I enjoyed the detail...Susan, hello! Wonderful post. I enjoyed the detail of a mask being waxed on the inside to keep it from being too heated. The logistics of that are hard to imagine. <br /><br />Did men ever wear masks? I don't think so, unless at a masquerade.<br /><br />Sandra<br /><br /><br />*****<br /><br />Website: http://www.sandragulland.com/<br />Blog: http://sandragulland.blogspot.com/<br />Facebook: http://tinyurl.com/3xzbgv<br />Twitter: http://twitter.com/Sandra_GullandSandra Gulland.https://www.blogger.com/profile/08796812564692897461noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5022318990784415929.post-43924461665735932472010-02-22T17:40:57.293-05:002010-02-22T17:40:57.293-05:00Glad you decided to post on this! I thought of doi...Glad you decided to post on this! I thought of doing an MA in the history of fashion at one time, had to give up the idea but if I had, I would definitely have chosen C17 masks as my dissertation subject. I did do some research into them at one point and gathered quite a bit of material, which is now goodness knows where - but I would like to share two of my favourite mask quotes.<br /><br />The first one, from historical fiction, will be familiar!<br /><em>When most women went masked in public places a man had to learn to judge beauty by very little detail-the colour and sheen of a curl escaping from a hood, the sparkle of a pair of eyes seen between narrow slits, the curve of a pretty mouth.</em><br />From Forever Amber by Kathleen Winsor<br /><br />The second one is from a genuine C17 source, Sebastiano Locatelli's Viaggio di Francia, an account by a Bolognese priest of his journey to Paris and back in 1664-5. The quote refers to three fellow passengers on a boat, women who worked in the wine trade and were travelling on business:<br /><em>For the first two days they never took off their little black velvet masks, waxed on the inside so as not to heat the face too much; but they carefully observed everything that went on. At last, seeing that there was nobody on board who would harm them, they unmasked themselves; and the beauty of one of them, who looked like a chaste Judith, astonished us all. Before that, we had all been dying to see them; and how right we were, because it's not every day that one can look at faces at once so pretty and so modest.'</em><br />Wilfred Blunt, Sebastiano, London 1956, pp182-3Miss Moppethttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05712153554458139838noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5022318990784415929.post-29571907825797224502010-02-22T15:24:02.348-05:002010-02-22T15:24:02.348-05:00Very interesting, do you know if it was common for...Very interesting, do you know if it was common for men to wear masks other than to masquerade balls/party?<br />Le Loup.<br />http://woodsrunnersdiary.blogspot.comKeithhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12562001301604097606noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5022318990784415929.post-64047047482002329702010-02-22T13:18:15.800-05:002010-02-22T13:18:15.800-05:00What a lovely, super-informative piece. Thank you!...What a lovely, super-informative piece. Thank you!DanielleThornehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13993889577292227348noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5022318990784415929.post-18382642818073878012010-02-22T10:58:55.811-05:002010-02-22T10:58:55.811-05:00Glad everyone is enjoying this -- do I sense an un...Glad everyone is enjoying this -- do I sense an unspoken desire for masks on Monday mornings? *g*<br /><br />Joyce, I do remember you from Chicago --welcome!<br /><br />Ingrid, "Earnest" is one of my favs, too. I've had several characters who've spoken exactly like Joan Greenwood (in my head, I mean.) I love her voice!<br /><br />Vanessa, I could only find one picture of a full-face mask in the book "Fashion & Fiction: Dress in Art & Literature in Stuart England" by Aileen Ribeiro, and though the print belongs to the City of London Museum, it's not on line. Alas, since I'm resolved not to scan or post copyrighted pictures, I can't share it here. But I will say it's indeed pretty creepy: a full oval face mask, all black, with little slits for the eyes and mouth, and a sculpted nose. <br /><br />If anyone's interested, here's the Amazon link to the Ribeiro book (the rest of the book is pretty dandy, too, a lavish Yale art book with lots of pictures):<br /><br />http://www.amazon.com/Fashion-Fiction-Literature-England-Studies/dp/0300109997/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1266853812&sr=1-1<br /><br />Also, Catherine Delors has just posted a bit about 18th c. French masks on her site, including a wonderful porcelain snuff box of a masked lady:<br />http://networkedblogs.com/p28308190Isabella Bradford/Susan Holloway Scotthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00997375216314200469noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5022318990784415929.post-23689472570639109752010-02-22T09:37:30.650-05:002010-02-22T09:37:30.650-05:00I too would think the half masks would conceal lit...I too would think the half masks would conceal little of the wearer's identity unless of course, the onlooker had never met the wearer before. But I think you're right, this does remind me of the sunglasses with the saucer sized lenses :o) <br /><br />Fascinating.nightsmusichttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05984119792540771870noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5022318990784415929.post-84727320439773342182010-02-22T09:14:48.189-05:002010-02-22T09:14:48.189-05:00Hi Susan: Met you at HNS conf., but found your blo...Hi Susan: Met you at HNS conf., but found your blog from Catherine's blog. Yeah! Especially loved the quote from Winter. Ah, so romantic and ... restrained in 17th c. Am linking to your post from my site.Joyce Moorehttp://www.joycemoorebooks.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5022318990784415929.post-66636254377720941752010-02-22T09:00:03.948-05:002010-02-22T09:00:03.948-05:00Fascinating! I'd love to see pictures of the ...Fascinating! I'd love to see pictures of the full face mask, which sound a bit creepy rather than mysterious.Vanessa Kellyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14571549124283013391noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5022318990784415929.post-40945974056503114432010-02-22T08:59:46.782-05:002010-02-22T08:59:46.782-05:00Thank you for posting this...I am fascinated...Thank you for posting this...I am fascinated...ChristyEnglishhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14621188801635359333noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5022318990784415929.post-71911494775886613692010-02-22T08:43:26.940-05:002010-02-22T08:43:26.940-05:00What an interesting post!
Those masks must also ha...What an interesting post!<br />Those masks must also have been skin protection when one was outside in winter.<br />And then of course there were the black or green voiles or veils, which were 17th-century sunglasses and sunscreens combined. They too might hide your identity if heavy enough. Though it's more of a late nineteenth-century motif, the heavily-veiled woman of mystery.<br />Which reminds me of Edith Evans elegantly folding back her (totally unconcealing) veil in The Importance of being Earnest. It was on television again last week. I do so love that film!Ingridnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5022318990784415929.post-78539092668767543322010-02-22T08:05:31.273-05:002010-02-22T08:05:31.273-05:00Fascinating! I too thought that masks were only wo...Fascinating! I too thought that masks were only worn for masquerades. I hope you will write about the masks of Venice soon.Lady Burgleyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09262125653902478062noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5022318990784415929.post-73578008342940160252010-02-22T06:54:30.439-05:002010-02-22T06:54:30.439-05:00Muse, by the 18th c., masks are mostly for masquer...Muse, by the 18th c., masks are mostly for masquerade. Except in Venice; the masks in Venice will require a whole 'nother post!<br /><br />Margaret, you're welcome. I'm looking forward to seeing exactly how you've used them as a plot device, heh-heh.<br /><br />Catherine, thank you for the link, and the idea!<br /><br />Personally, I like to think of these masks kind of like the 17th c. version of oversized sunglasses -- an elegant and mysterious way to hide in plain sight.Isabella Bradford/Susan Holloway Scotthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00997375216314200469noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5022318990784415929.post-13561382170971837772010-02-22T03:04:54.983-05:002010-02-22T03:04:54.983-05:00You are most welcome, Susan! I will link to this w...You are most welcome, Susan! I will link to this wonderful post from ye olde blog, if you don't mind.Catherine Delorshttp://blog.catherinedelors.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5022318990784415929.post-85550096746054999972010-02-21T22:50:42.836-05:002010-02-21T22:50:42.836-05:00Thanks for the unmasking of 17th century masks! Ev...Thanks for the unmasking of 17th century masks! Ever a fascinating subject, and a convenient plot device!Margaret Porterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16202290659191790984noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5022318990784415929.post-11384706398856054792010-02-21T22:42:53.202-05:002010-02-21T22:42:53.202-05:00What a great post! I had no idea masks were worn s...What a great post! I had no idea masks were worn so often, I thought it was only to be found at events like a masquerade or such.Svea Lovehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08155352839052427783noreply@blogger.com